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Post by dbandre on Jan 2, 2008 13:55:57 GMT -5
I wish I would have seen this thread when it started... Only thing i'll point out, even though i'm 4 months late...is that the final stages of the race did show a dramatic drop in speed( I have splits) And that Powell is as good if not better out of the blocks as Ben Johnson..... R/T 0.137 10m - Don't know what I did with this split 20m - 2.88 30m - 3.79 (0.91) 40m - 4.65 (0.86) 50m - 5.49 (0.84) 60m - 6.32 (0.83 70m - 7.15 (0.83) 80m - 7.98 (0.83 90m - 8.84 (0.86) 100m - 9.74(0.90) 0.85 followed by a 0.87 would have been a more normal, natural progression at that speed from 80-100m, if he had run through the line. So he shut it down as the video showed. I'm sure if he knew how fast he was running he would have run through the line. A couple of problems is the track at Rieti didn't have the equipment to record the splits. So someone did this by video on a panning camera, without knowledge of the camera's distance from the track or 10m segments or any knowledge of any points of reference to do the necessary trigonometry. The IAAF never published his splits, so were did these come from? Gatlin Doha's splits 10m 20m 30m 40m 50m 60m 70m 80m 90m 100m Total time 1.93 2.98 3.89 4.74 5.58 6.39 7.21 8.07 8.91 9.77 Split time 1.93 1.05 0.91 0.85 0.84 0.81 0.82 0.86 0.84 0.86 Speed [m s-1] 5.18 9.52 10.99 11.76 11.90 12.35 12.20 11.63 11.90 11.63
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Post by anthonyj on Jan 2, 2008 20:20:43 GMT -5
Here's an article on Wallace Spearman Jr.. If you remember, Wallace Spearman's Father was an excellent sprinter from Chicago who put on one of the best shows ever his senior year at the Illinois State Track Meet. Spearmon Looking to Father for Inspiration in 2008 Wednesday 2 January 2008
Fayetteville, Arkansas, USA – There is only one comparison that matters to Wallace Spearmon Jr. when it comes to his father Wallace Spearmon Sr.
“Everything he did, I want to do better and I want to do what he didn’t do,” Spearmon Jr. said. Spearmon Jr. took care of one when he won the silver medal in the 2005 IAAF World Championships in Helsinki for the family’s first World Championships medal. He added a second with a bronze medal in Osaka in August.
The elder Spearmon’s best finish was fifth in the 200m semifinals in the 1987 World Championships in Rome.
Next on the agenda is to become the family’s first Olympian. A gold medal in Beijing would go a long way toward redemption in what Spearmon called a forgettable showing in Osaka. “It was a letdown and I felt that I was better than third place,” Spearmon said. “I shoot to win and if I don’t win I have some work to do. It’s a simple fact since I have been young. I always want to win even if it’s a game of Scrabble.”
Coaching Change strengthens father-son bond
The biggest question mark in Spearmon’s preparation for Beijing has been a coaching change from Lance Brauman to his father this fall.
Brauman, who coached Spearmon since his freshman season at Arkansas in 2004 and who has worked with World champions Tyson Gay and Veronica Campbell, was convicted of embezzlement, theft and mail fraud in 2006.
During the 2007 season, Spearmon trained from workouts that Brauman had written in notebooks for Spearmon, Gay and Campbell for the year before he went to prison. It was a difficult transition working out unsupervised but even more so as he pondered his training situation for 2008.
“We just tried to stick together as a group, but it was pretty difficult being the baby of the group and kind of trying to motivate myself,” said Spearmon, who turned 23 on 24 Dec.
Brauman moved to Orlando after serving a 10-month sentence at the Texarkana Federal Correction Institute in Texas on five counts related to paying athletes for work not performed while he was the coach at Barton County (Kan.) Community College.
Gay is continuing to train with Brauman in Florida. The burden of relocating weighed on Spearmon throughout the USATF and World Championships. “It was of the most difficult decisions that I have made, it was not easy to concentrate,” Spearmon said.
In the end, Spearmon, a self-proclaimed country boy who enjoys horseback riding, said that he felt more comfortable staying in Fayetteville where he attended high school and won the 2004 and 2005 NCAA Outdoor 200m titles while attending Arkansas.
“I didn’t need any new distractions,” Spearmon said. “If it works, I’ll stick with it. If not, I am still young and have time to recover.”
Thus far, things have been progressing well with the relationship between Spearmon and his father. The elder Spearmon, who began working with his son toward the end of the 2007 season, has incorporated “explosive” workouts in contrast to the overdistance and hill training that his son had done in the past.
“It all starts in the fall; that carries me through the whole season,” said Spearmon, who is often joined in training with college teammate Maurice Bridges.
Expanding sprint horizons while focusing on 200m
Spearmon’s fall training program has been designed in an attempt to run under 10 seconds in the 100, sub-20 in the 200 and sub-45 in the 400. The 400m is the event that has provided the most difficulty for Spearmon, who ran 9.96 in the 100m in Shanghai in September and 19.65 in the 200m in 2006 – a mark that ranks as No. 4 on the all-time performance list.
“Right now, I am still trying to figure out the technique,” Spearmon said about the 400m where he has a best of 45.22 from 2006. “I give a lot of respect to Jeremy (Wariner) and what all those guys and doing there.”
Spearmon plans to run only one indoor meet in 2008 – the Tyson Invitational in Fayetteville – with his outdoor season commencing in April with the Texas, Mt. San Antonio College and Penn Relays in preparation for 200m in the U.S. Olympic Trials 27 June-6 July in Eugene, Ore.
In 2007 Spearmon posted wins in the adidas Track Classic, Reebok Grand Prix and Prefontaine Classic and finished second in the USATF Championships and ran a season-best 19.82. He failed however to match his PB of 19.65, but did produce four sub 19.9 clockings, running with his trademark gold necklace clenched in his teeth during races. There’s little concern, however, for Spearmon heading into 2008.
“I didn’t have any goals but to win (the World Championships),” Spearmon said. “You can’t run a PR every year so it wasn’t really a let down. It just means it is something special and to look forward to when you do PR.”
Deep U.S. Talent in the 200m
As in the 2007 national championships, the 200m figures to be among the most competitive events in the U.S. Trials with reigning World 100m and 200m champion Tyson Gay (19.62), Xavier Carter (19.63) and Spearmon (19.65) who hold the Nos. 2, 3 and 4 spots on the all-time performer list. There’s also collegian Walter Dix of Florida State, who ran 19.69 for the second-fastest time in the world of 2007.
“There’s a lot of guys and it’s deeper than the 100m, but I think to make the team, I just need to stay motivated and do everything correctly. From eating right and dedicating myself to track to make it this year,” Spearmon said.
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Post by off on Jan 2, 2008 21:37:48 GMT -5
I wish I would have seen this thread when it started... Only thing i'll point out, even though i'm 4 months late...is that the final stages of the race did show a dramatic drop in speed( I have splits) And that Powell is as good if not better out of the blocks as Ben Johnson..... R/T 0.137 10m - Don't know what I did with this split 20m - 2.88 30m - 3.79 (0.91) 40m - 4.65 (0.86) 50m - 5.49 (0.84) 60m - 6.32 (0.83 70m - 7.15 (0.83) 80m - 7.98 (0.83 90m - 8.84 (0.86) 100m - 9.74(0.90) 0.85 followed by a 0.87 would have been a more normal, natural progression at that speed from 80-100m, if he had run through the line. So he shut it down as the video showed. I'm sure if he knew how fast he was running he would have run through the line. A couple of problems is the track at Rieti didn't have the equipment to record the splits. So someone did this by video on a panning camera, without knowledge of the camera's distance from the track or 10m segments or any knowledge of any points of reference to do the necessary trigonometry. The IAAF never published his splits, so were did these come from? Gatlin Doha's splits 10m 20m 30m 40m 50m 60m 70m 80m 90m 100m Total time 1.93 2.98 3.89 4.74 5.58 6.39 7.21 8.07 8.91 9.77 Split time 1.93 1.05 0.91 0.85 0.84 0.81 0.82 0.86 0.84 0.86 Speed [m s-1] 5.18 9.52 10.99 11.76 11.90 12.35 12.20 11.63 11.90 11.63
The IAAF isn't the only group or organization that does any research or conducts these types of things. Not only that, IAAF splits are often questioned too. And have been off on occasion. For example, Mike Marsh supposedly split 10.0 to lead off one fo the world record setting 4x1's that ran 37.40. That split is known world wide to be off. Also, when it comes to Gatlin, no one has ever split faster than 0.82(officially). I believe 0.82 or 0.83 is the fastest ever recorded. And for gatlin to go from 0.81, 0.82, to 0.86 is should tell you something is off. That type of drop off in speed would indicate a shut down of some sort. He would have run 9.6 with the middle portion of his race looking like that with a "normal" deceleration rate. Which is why I think the splits i've seen for Gatlin in Doha look a little different than what you have. Gatlin Doha 2006 RT: 0.166 [0.17] 10m: 1.88 [1.71] 20m: 2.93 [1.05] 30m: 3.85 [0.92] 40m: 4.70 [0.85] 50m: 5.55 [0.85] 60m: 6.39 [0.84] 70m: 7.23 [0.84] 80m: 8.07 [0.84] 90m: 8.92 [0.85] 100m: 9.77 [0.85] You can't assume what knowledge the person had that gave those splits for Powell. The equipment available to the IAAF isn't special order just for them. I don't work for the IAAF, I know where all the markings on the track are what they mean, and where they are relative to each other and everything else. Who am I to say that someone else may not have that same knowledge along with some software, equipment, etc. Tyson Gay 2007 Osaka 9.85 R/T 0.143 10m: 1.90(1.90) 20m: 2.94(1.04) 30m: 3.86(0.92) 40m: 4.73(0.88) 50m: 5.59(0.85) 60m: 6.44(0.85) 70m: 7.28(0.84) 80m: 8.13(0.85) 90m: 8.99(0.86) 100m: 9.85(0.86)
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Post by dbandre on Jan 2, 2008 23:42:44 GMT -5
Not trying to question you or your analysis of the splits given. I am just questioning the splits data. I realize the IAAF isn't the only organization that has the equipment. Just that camera angle is important and the IAAF or Rieti organization would have to provide the equipment themselves or through a 3rd party. I looked at the deceleration after the finish and powell's was by far the longest suggesting his finishing speed was greater than his competitors.
My only problem with your analysis is that Powell would have run sub 9.7 most likely. I really think anyone running 9.7s or better is likely doping. The fastest recorded 100m ever is 9.69s with a 5 m/s wind aide, 3.3 m/s faster than in Powell's race. Powell's 9.78 in the finals at Rieti with no wind is just as impressive as the 9.74 w/ 1.7 m/s wind. What would be nice is if someone overlayed the starts of both races and determined were the .04s went and I would argue that they dissappeared over the course of the race not in the last 10m.
BTW the split data you gave (Powell's, Gatlin, and Gay) reminds me a lot of flo-jo wr run with 4 or more consecutive 10m segments at maximum velocity (a difference of less than .01s). I find those very suspicious of doping, it may also represent the of limits of maximal velocity as well.
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Post by off on Jan 3, 2008 2:06:32 GMT -5
There's always a possibility of doping. I just try not to assume simply because someone is running fast or faster. There are signs, but running fast alone isn't one of them.
Two things play a part in those splits being the way they are. Momentum & wind. In 4 of the 5 races where Powell ran 9.7, the wind was 1.0 or higher. The 9.78 was the only race with no wind. And I don't have the splits for those, but I do remember hearing that his top speed and maintenance wasn't the same. Same goes for Gatlin. It's no surprise to me that they run those types of splits when the wind is that high. Same with Flo Jo. The reason why a lot of people think she was doping was because of her times, but it's widely known and acknowledged that the 10.49 race was heavily wind aided. The race just so happened to read 0.0. Not saying she didn't dope, but that race in particular was most likely the product of wind. Combine the wind, with the high rate of acceleration and you'll have an athlete maintain a higher rate of speed longer than if there was no wind. This is why 9.8 is what Powell has run when there was less wind. This is why his 9.78 run is regarded as his best. You can even throw in the 9.83 he ran into a -0.3. He even considers that race(9.83) one of his best ever.
Comparing Powell to Obadele is joke really(no offense). They are like night and day. Powell accelerates as good or better than anyone i've ever seen, while Obadele has one of the worst starts of all elite 100m runners. Obadele has a altitude assited pr of 9.87 that he's never come close to before or after. When you look at Powell's strengths and combine that with his height, etc, it's pretty easy to see why he runs as fast as he does. His technique is almost flawless, and he's just about mastered the 100m. You can't rule out doping, but I tend to think less of that being the case when someone is that technically sound.
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Post by anthonyj on Jan 3, 2008 10:09:57 GMT -5
Justin Gatlin is not going to go down without a fight and I don't blame him. Check out the story below- Gatlin to challenge four-year ban, consider federal lawsuit Associated Press
Updated: January 2, 2008, 5:22 PM ET
Olympic champion sprinter Justin Gatlin will challenge his four-year doping suspension and may take the case to federal court.
"We may have to file multiple actions at the same time," Gatlin's attorney John Collins told The Associated Press on Wednesday.
A three-member arbitration panel voted 2-1 to suspend Gatlin, who faced a possible eight-year ban for his second doping offense, in a 53-page ruling released Tuesday.
Under the panel's ruling, Gatlin would be eligible to run May 25, 2010. That would prevent him from defending his 100-meter title at the Beijing Olympics this August. If the sprinter can get his first offense erased, it likely would result in a two-year ban that would expire this May, a month before the U.S. Olympic trials.
Asked if he thought any appeal or court action could be completed in time, Collins said, "I don't know. Obviously that's the goal."
He said he believes there is precedent for a U.S. court ruling to be applied internationally, but acknowledges that's not a certainty.
Gatlin tested positive for excessive testosterone at the Kansas Relays in April 2006. It was his second doping offense. As a 19-year-old competitor at the world junior championships, Gatlin tested positive for amphetamines, part of a prescribed medication he was taking for attention deficit disorder.
The panel unanimously ruled Gatlin committed a doping offense in April 2006, but the sprinter's first doping offense in 2001 troubled the group.
Gatlin had taken medication for attention deficit disorder since childhood. He stopped taking the medication three days before the competition, but small amounts still were detected.
Gatlin continued to compete for the University of Tennessee and was reinstated for international competition after just one year of what would have been a two-year ban. An arbitration panel in the 2001 case determined Gatlin did not attempt to cheat.
That panel, however, didn't find that he had "no fault" in the case. Collins argued there was no such finding because none was required under rules in place at the time.
Gatlin can appeal to the Court of Arbitration for Sport, take the 2001 case back to the International Association of Athletics Federations or challenge the ruling in federal court. A lawsuit would maintain that his first offense should be thrown out because it violates Gatlin's rights under the Americans With Disabilities Act.
Christopher Campbell was the dissenter in the panel's 2-1 vote.
"Increasing Mr. Gatlin's sanction for his first violation because of his disability is blatant discrimination in violation of the Americans With Disabilities Act," Campbell wrote.
Campbell, a former Olympic wrestler who has dissented in several arbitration panel rulings against athletes, accused anti-doping organizations of "behaving as if they are above the law."
"In these situations, they are nothing more than bullies preying on the vulnerable," Campbell wrote. "The federal government should take a serious look at this practice."
Collins, who also represented Gatlin in the 2001 case, said he would meet with the family to determine the next course of action.
"We have to talk it over," he said in a telephone interview from his Chicago office. "We're going to do something."
Collins harshly criticized the panel for failing to mention how many of the advanced, more elaborate tests Gatlin had passed before and after the 2006 positive test. Collins had argued that Gatlin unknowingly had a testosterone cream applied to him by a disgruntled massage therapist, who repeatedly has denied the allegations.
The sprinter also said he received an injection of what supposedly was vitamin B-12 from Randall Evans, an assistant to coach Trevor Graham, in the weeks leading up to the Kansas competition.
While praising Gatlin's demeanor and cooperation, the panel said it could not rule out the possibility that he had knowingly taken the drug.
"You're presumed guilty until proven innocent," Collins said of the process.
The panel criticized the lack of witnesses, but Collins said there was no way to force Evans or Graham to testify. Graham has been indicted on a charge of lying to federal authorities in the BALCO investigation.
The panel noted Gatlin cooperated with Bay Area Laboratory Co-Operative investigators, even consenting to a wiretap during telephone conversations with Graham. But Collins criticized the ruling for failing to mention that BALCO lead investigator Jeff Novitzky testified he found no evidence Gatlin ever knowingly used performance enhancing drugs.
Collins said he believes the panel was swayed by the fact that Graham was Gatlin's coach.
"It's guilt by association," Collins said.
Copyright 2008 by The Associated Press
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Post by dbandre on Jan 3, 2008 12:14:08 GMT -5
Gatlin should try to continue with a football career. I really don't care about known cheaters and I believe most other people don't either.
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Post by illini1 on Jan 3, 2008 14:06:57 GMT -5
Gatlin should try to continue with a football career. I really don't care about known cheaters and I believe most other people don't either. In Gatlin's defense, his first positive test was for a drug that he was taking for attention deficit disorder when he was still in college, which is why his punishment for the 2006 positive test for steroids has been so harsh (first 8 years, now 4). Unfortunately I think the culture of track and field today is such that you can't make a mistake like that, regardless of whether it was "intentional" or not. For the sake of track and field, I'm glad Gatlin is out, even though it sucks for him. I would agree with dbandre, give football a shot a la Bob Hayes and see what happens. Give the folks in the NFL an idea of what real speed is. The reality is that the USA Track and Field doesn't even need him and track and field as a world body is better off kicking out cheaters for good. For all intents and purposes, Gatlin's track career is OVER.
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Post by anthonyj on Jan 4, 2008 7:33:59 GMT -5
There's more to the Gatlin case then meets the eye. Here's more information. This is important to know because all of the doping crackdown began with track and field and now when athletes in other professional sports look at this case, they may be less likely to cooperate.
Gatlin's cooperation nets him next to nothing By Shaun Assael ESPN The Magazine Updated: January 3, 2008
When George Mitchell released his long-awaited report on performance-enhancing drugs in baseball last month, he suggested that MLB not punish the players he wrote about. After all, he said, everyone makes mistakes.
The ex-Senator didn't use the word "amnesty" in making his appeal for leniency, and for good reason. According to my dictionary, amnesty means "a period during which crimes can be admitted without prosecution." Virtually no one whose cooperation he sought talked to him. They all hid -- and if you believe Roger Clemens' trainer, Brian McNamee, are still hiding -- behind a mile-wide strike zone of silence.
In Olympic sports, we have the exact opposite problem: Too much punishment and not enough common sense. That, at least, is the impression left by the four-year ban meted out to track star Justin Gatlin on Tuesday.
Gatlin's sentence stems, in part, from a drug test he failed when he was a 19-year-old scholarship student at the University of Tennessee. With summer school midterms coming up, he took medication for attention deficit disorder, a condition he's had since he was 9 years old. Even though he stopped taking the meds three days before the junior nationals, he had enough in his system to trip a test for elevated levels of amphetamine.
At least for now, Justin Gatlin's sprint to the 2008 Summer Olympics has run into the brick wall of a suspension. With that 2001 "violation" on his record, Gatlin couldn't afford a second mistake. Yet in July 2006, he flunked a test at the Kansas Relays for elevated testosterone. The grinding machinery of the U.S. Anti-Doping Agency promptly went into gear.
Gatlin's most persuasive argument as he challenges the four-year ban is that the first bust wasn't really a bust at all -- but something that would be considered a "no fault violation" under today's rules. As such, the Kansas case should be considered his first violation and subject to a two-year ban. With that math, he'd be eligible to compete in the Olympic trials in May.
Everything that's wrong with the World Anti-Doping Agency's code can be found in the tortured analysis of this argument by the 2-1 majority on the arbitration panel that handed down the decision. It goes on and on -- and on -- about how the arbitrators in the 2001 case clearly intended to show Gatlin wasn't at fault. "Mr. Gatlin neither cheated nor intended to cheat," wrote the judges, Ed Colbert and Sam Cheris.
But here's the Catch-22. Since the WADA code wasn't in effect back then, the 2001 panel didn't make an explicit "no fault" finding under the code that would let the 2007 panel discount it as a violation. You getting this? Gatlin is being punished by the WADA code for the simple fact that the WADA code wasn't in effect in 2001.
Right about now, you should be imagining Lucy picking up the football on poor ol' Charlie Brown.
The arbitrators end up telling Gatlin that he should go back to the original agency that imposed the sentence -- the IAAF -- and get the no fault finding. But that's a little bit like me rooting around in the basement for an old tax return so I can file for a six-year-old deduction. Who knows how long that will take? And time isn't on Gatlin's side, which is why his lawyer, John P. Collins, is appealing to the Swiss-based Court of Arbitration for Sport, and might open up a second front in U.S. federal court.
Gatlin, who hopes to defend the 100-meter gold medal he won at the 2004 Olympics, was supposed to be the new face of American track-- the clean antidote to all the drugged-up record holders of the past, starting with Ben Johnson and ending with those conviction-crossed ex-lovers, Marion Jones and Tim Montgomery. Even the arbitrators who ruled against Gatlin concede he "seems like a complete gentlemen [sic]."
Maybe he was naïve in picking the most drug-connected coach of all time, Trevor Graham, to work with him. Or maybe he was just bowing to a perverse reality in track: It takes a dirty coach to help a clean athlete beat his or her dirty rivals. It doesn't matter. Once he tested positive a second time, he did precisely what the prosecutors from the USADA wanted: He wore a wire to gather evidence against Graham.
This is exactly the kind of behavior we're told we're supposed to applaud, and the very thing that Mitchell castigated MLB's players for not doing. Gatlin accepted the reality of his second positive finding (not precisely the same as admitting guilt, but close enough) and agreed to help IRS special agent Jeff Novitzky investigate Graham. According to the Washington Post's Amy Shipley, who broke the story, Gatlin taped his coach on at least 10 occasions.
Here's where the case gets ludicrous. Instead of holding Gatlin up as a model, the USADA's prosecutors invoked yet another rule in the endlessly flexible WADA code. This one states that a defendant's cooperation has to yield evidence of a new, undiscovered doping violation. Never mind that Gatlin's tapes will no doubt be used in an upcoming federal trial in which Graham stands accused of obstructing justice. (They've already been handed over to Graham's defense.) The USADA's general counsel, Bill Bock, argued that Gatlin didn't do enough to merit a reduction of his ban.
Some of the evidence against Trevor Graham in his upcoming trial came from Gatlin. To their credit, Colbert and Cheris saw through that claim, arguing it is disingenuous and misplaced, since the agency was positively lazy in how it availed itself of Gatlin.
"The panel finds that Mr. Gatlin has provided substantial assistance to the United States Government in investigating doping in sport," they wrote. "He immediately cooperated with the IRS without hesitation. He made undercover calls. He wore a wire, putting himself at risk. While USADA contended that Mr. Gatlin did not 'cooperate' with it in any investigations and ought not to be given credit … the record reflects that USADA never sought to avail itself of Mr. Gatlin's assistance, and that is not within Mr. Gatlin's control."
Guess it's time to stop taking such long lunches, guys.
The net effect of this decision might be to discourage the very cooperation that the USADA says it wants. During his years as the agency's general counsel, Travis Tygart, who was recently promoted to CEO, helped run up a perfect 36-0 win record in arbitration cases. But as defense lawyers get better at picking apart the science of these cases, the tide might be turning. On Dec. 15, the USADA suffered its first-ever loss when an arbitration panel ruled in favor of another Beijing hopeful, sprinter LaTasha Jenkins. The panel found that a urine sample that tested positive for nandrolone in Belgium was tainted by two European labs that didn't follow international standards.
So it's little wonder the USADA is trying to turn itself into more of a law enforcement agency, relying on cops such as Novitzky to bring it cases.
"We all know that testing alone will never provide a complete solution to the problem of doping," Tygart told dailypeleton.com in an interview last year. But after the way it "rewarded" Gatlin for sticking his neck out, I'm hard-pressed to understand why any athlete would risk helping it. Collins says he's already hearing about coaches who are advising their clients to clam up.
The net effect of this decision? It makes baseball players look smart for their stonewalling.
Shaun Assael, a senior writer for ESPN The Magazine, writes extensively about doping in track and field, baseball and other sports in his new book, "Steroid Nation,"
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Post by dbandre on Jan 4, 2008 11:10:15 GMT -5
There is not more than meets the eye in the Gatlin case. He hired a trainer who was already suspected of doping his athletes. He miraculously went from a very good collegiate sprinter to elite WC sprinter in less than 2 years. Trust me, very good athletes are looking for shortcuts all the time. US law will not trump IAAF and WADA rules, they are not governed by US law. CAS won't overturn the results, they may reduce his suspension to 2 years, but that would mean he would miss the trials because he was dumb enough to run the US championships in 2006, meaning he will likely miss qualifying. It's his own d**n fault and no one wants him on the team.
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Post by plyometric on Jan 5, 2008 11:24:07 GMT -5
For anyone who thinks Gatlin should fight his case, my question to you is why? Consider this for a moment, when the story broke about the massage therapist supposedly sabbotaging Gatlin, in which Trevor stated this originally, not Gatlin. Gatlin is suppose to be turning on Trevor, Gatlin has also claimed that the therapist did this to him later on. How do you reconcile rolling on Graham and using his excuse? That to me is fishy at best. Testing cannot and will not ever stop anyone from cheating, it can however expose you, not stop you. Gatlin was exposed as a result of the test, now he wants the public to believe he didn't do it and had no knowledge of it. Okay... right
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Post by illini1 on Jan 5, 2008 18:46:10 GMT -5
For anyone who thinks Gatlin should fight his case, my question to you is why? Consider this for a moment, when the story broke about the massage therapist supposedly sabbotaging Gatlin, in which Trevor stated this originally, not Gatlin. Gatlin is suppose to be turning on Trevor, Gatlin has also claimed that the therapist did this to him later on. How do you reconcile rolling on Graham and using his excuse? That to me is fishy at best. Testing cannot and will not ever stop anyone from cheating, it can however expose you, not stop you. Gatlin was exposed as a result of the test, now he wants the public to believe he didn't do it and had no knowledge of it. Okay... right Trevor Graham is most certainly a liar and a cheat, and Gatlin, given the evidence that we have, seems to fall into that category as well. Even if there is undisputed evidence that the massage therapist is to blame in Gatlin's case, it would be irrelevant. The drug policy of the IAAF is that the ATHLETE is responsible for what goes into his/her body, regardless of whether or not their use of any banned substance (presumably as a result of disgruntled massage therapists everywhere) was intentional or not.
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Post by anthonyj on Jan 5, 2008 21:21:45 GMT -5
I have a couple of problems with Gatlin's case. When I said that there's more to this story then meets the eye, I meant it on a couple of levels. 1) As far as I'm concerned Gatlin has served his time. Why? Because his first "offense" was bogus. Period. The Government and the IAAF changes their list of Illegal Substances as often as the wind changes directions. Remember when Torri Edwards took a medication for I believe sinus' and she was suspended and couldn't run at the last olympics. The suspension was lifted after the olympics because all of a sudden the drug in the medication was no longer part of the illegal list. So she was able to run last year at the world championships. I remember reading when Inger Miller hade a Coke before a race a few years ago, and she was DQ'd for having too much caffeine in her system. Which is my second point -- 2)What is legal and illegal? I still don't know. The government and the IAAF are so busy cracking down on people that everyone's confused as to what substances should and should not be on the list. If someone cheats, I want them out there's not a question about that. Baseball has a list of illegal substances, we know what it is, Football and Basketball too. We may not totally agree, but at least we know. The Track and Field Agencies need to come up with a list and stick with it. You can't suspend someone who took cough medicine and later on say " well we made a mistake". Our sport isn't like others were our athletes get guaranteed contracts, and multi million dollar signing bonuses. 3) Gatlin is a fall guy because they want his coach. Gatlin is at fault for dealing with Graham in the first place. Tyson Gay and Veronica Campbell have a shady coach as well and they need to dump him before they get could up in some B. S.. If Gatlin was a 30 something year old athlete who got a lot better ( like we see in another sport) then I would have more problems with the postitive test. But be that as it may, I accept the last test because he should not have been dealing with Graham in the first place. My favorite sport above all others is track and field. But the nonsense that the government is pulling is hurting more then it's helping. When the athletes in the "big money" sports, ie. Baseball, Football, and Basketball, see how they are dealing with this situation then you are going to see less cooperation from them when they are accused of using illegal substances.
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Post by dbandre on Jan 7, 2008 6:45:15 GMT -5
Gatlin's biggest problem will be that he raced in June of 2006. His other problem will be getting a qualifying mark in time. Most open races in the NCAA will be done. He should have received a lifetime ban. He's lucky that the IAAF went from 4 year to 2 year bans several years ago on first offense's.
Torri Edwards case has nothing to do with Gatlin's case and ignorance is not a defense. I will be perfectly happy when all the times at the Olympic and WC 100m dash are back around 9.93s. I don't know how you can defend someone like Gatlin.
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Post by anthonyj on Jan 7, 2008 20:12:34 GMT -5
9.93? There's guys in college this year who could run that time. 3 come to mind- Walter Dix from Florida State, Trindon Holliday from LSU, and J Lee Samuels from Arkansas. There's also Rynell Parson, a junior in high school in Texas who ran a 10.23 last summer and might run under 10 flat before he gets in college. As far as Torri Edwards- whether or not she had a defense for her positive drug test, the bottom line is that she was right. If I was her I would have sued for lost income. Justin Gatlin- In 2001 as a 19 year old he figures by taking ADD medication a few weeks before a meet he would run faster. OK? Anyway, he gets a positive drug test and is told not to speak negative about the process and don't fight it. If you do that we'll take care of you. By the way we want you to wear this wire and go talk to your coach. Gatlin does everything he's told to do and the government then say's sorry we can't do anything for you. Gatlin was dumb on two fronts 1) He should have fired his coach years ago 2) He should have faught the positive drug test at the very beginning . The governments wants Graham and they used Gatlin to get him. Gatlin missed most of the 2006 and all of the 2007 season and one can argue that this has costed him over 1 million dollars in earnings. I think he's paid enough and I've said enough. I'm moving on to other topies unless of course I can find another article about this.
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Post by dbandre on Jan 8, 2008 0:25:02 GMT -5
Too bad Samuels has regressed since coming to the collegiate ranks. Why he was picked as the 4th guy for the 100m in Osaka was mind boggling. Holliday best run was a 10.05 with a very helpful wind. Dix is the only one who has broken 10s. I look at the Brits who didn't do PED's and they are all in the 10.1s range. Take a look at the difference between the top sprinters PR's over the past 2-3 seasons and you'll see what I mean. Only 4-5 guys who always run under 10s and about 40 who run 10.1s range.
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Post by trackfan19 on Jan 8, 2008 21:21:19 GMT -5
dbandre,
J-Mee Samuels was not picked for Osaka, he earned that spot. You know that we do not pick the team, you earn your spot. Samuels was 5th at USATF Nationals. Holliday and Dix who finished ahead of him elected to not compete at World Champs. The only picking at Worlds, Olympics, Pan Am's are done by the coaches for relay spots. Also Samuels has battled hamstring injuries the past two seasons at Arkansas. If he stays healthy he should be back in the 10 flat range.
Also to reply to a previous comment about Gatlin. Gatlin was more than just a very good collegiate sprinter at Tennessee. He won six (6) individual NCAA sprint titles in his first two and only collegiate seasons, turning pro after his sophomore year. His 19.86 was the collegiate record. He was a world class sprinter while at Tennessee and a big meet performer. As for his doping violation.....Whatever the penalty is that WADA and/or USADA finally decides, lets just live with it and let Gatlin decide if he wants to return to the sport.
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Post by dbandre on Jan 9, 2008 3:53:45 GMT -5
Samuels was picked, the US had an extra spot. Gatlin's 100m title in 2005 gave the US 4 members possible. They picked Samuels, the preceeding champions country gets the spot. So to earn that spot you really have to finish 4th or better which he did not at the US championship.
Finals 1 Tyson Gay adidas 9.84M -0.5
5 J-Mee Samuels Arkansas 10.22 -0.5 6 Leroy Dixon Nike 10.25 -0.5
Notice that only Gay made the finals. Injuries aside, A runner like Samuels is not going to perform at a place like Arkansas.
As for Gatlin, he was never a great 100m collegiate sprinter. He has some fast times and was an individual champion, but comparatively speaking he was a good collegiate sprinter. Really we are talking semantics here, it's like people who called Jeremy Wariner one of the greatest 400m sprinters ever after his Olympic victory in 2004. Gatlin was a great junior level sprinter, but 6 time ncaa champions are a dime a dozen at LSU, Clemson, Tennessee, Florida, Arkansas, Baylor. His times as a collegian are noteworthy as a "junior athlete" were his 100m time is a junior record, but some years they would still place him 3rd. Walter Dix is a great collegiate sprinter even t
My point is Gatlin who never broke 10.05s finally goes pro and goes 9.97s in 2003 after a year with Trevor Grahamn. The following year he runs 9.85s as Olympic Champion under Grahamn. In 2 seasons under one of the best sprint coaches in the land Vince Anderson he was an NCAA 100m champ, he was on his way too greatness. Then he turns pro under a coach we now know who had athletes achieve pr's under him while taking PED's. Yeah, I know the huge initial jump looks odd, but training under Vince Anderson is about neurological training and most HS training is metabolic in nature so it's not a huge surprise to see that initial jump followed by very small jumps. Note that when Gatlin changed coaches he made what I like to call PED jumps in PR's. .08s, .12s, .07s, .08s. You might think it's strange that Gatlin didn't PR the year following the Olympics. I don't because the stigma of being Olympic or World Champ means greater drug testing. The very reason why he was busted in 2006. You shouldn't be shocked to know that I think Powell's PR's reflect this same PED pattern as well.
2006 9.77 1.7 Doha 12 05 2006 2005 9.88 0.4 Helsinki 07 08 2005 2004 9.85 0.6 Athína 22 08 2004 2003 9.97 1.3 Zürich 15 08 2003 2002 10.05 0.5 Baton Rouge, LA 31 05 2002 2002 10.05 1.1 Knoxville, TN 06 04 2002 2001 10.08 0 Eugene, OR 02 06 2001 2000 10.36 0.7 Raleigh, NC 17 06 2000
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Post by dbandre on Jan 9, 2008 19:03:43 GMT -5
Just to drive this point home.
Gatlin had 3 straight years of substantial increases in pr's. You look across the 90s' and you don't find this at all in any WC class sprinter. They might make a jump in pr 1 year and not pr again for 2-3 years. When 2 of the 4 men to run 9.80s have tested positive its not hard to question those results of Powell and even Greene.
Powell 2007 9.74 1.7 Rieti 2006 9.77 1 Zürich 18 08 2006 2006 9.77 1.5 Gateshead 11 06 2006 2005 9.77 1.6 Athína (Olympic Stadium) 14 06 2005 2004 9.87 0.2 Bruxelles 03 09 2004 2003 10.02 0.8 Bruxelles 05 09 2003 2002 10.12 1.3 Rovereto 28 08 2002
Greene
2006 10.35 -0.5 Baie Mahault 01 05 2006 2005 10.01 1.9 Carson, CA 25 06 2005 2004 9.87 0.6 Athína 22 08 2004 2003 9.94 1.4 Carson, CA 01 06 2003 2002 9.89 0.9 Roma 12 07 2002 2001 9.82 -0.2 Edmonton 05 08 2001 2000 9.86 -0.2 Berlin 01 09 2000 1999 9.79 0.1 Athína 16 06 1999 1998 9.90 0.3 Stockholm 05 08 1998 1997 9.86 0.2 Athína 03 08 1997 1996 10.08 0.3 Atlanta, GA 14 06 1996 1995 10.19 0.8 Bratislava 30 05 1995 1993 10.43 1993
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Post by off on Jan 10, 2008 0:09:10 GMT -5
If your country has a reigning world champion, if that athlete isn't competing that athlete still counts as one of the 4 allowed to represent that event. They weren't going to give the U.S. 4 spots just because Gatlin was the previous world champion. Becuase he was out of the picture, they were back down to the normal 3 per event.
1 Tyson Gay adidas 9.84M -0.5 2 Trindon Holliday L S U 10.07 -0.5 3 Walter Dix Florida State 10.09 -0.5 4 Mark Jelks Nike 10.13 -0.5 5 J-Mee Samuels Arkansas 10.22 -0.5 6 Leroy Dixon Nike 10.25 -0.5 7 Leonard Scott Nike 10.26 -0.5 [10.251] 8 Darvis Patton adidas 10.26 -0.5 [10.255]
The U.S. was required to use Samuels on the team because technically he was the 3rd guy. But they weren't required to use him on the relay which is why he saw no part of it. But J-Mee actually did earned the spot becuase of his 5th place finish. Similar situation happened in 2005. Wallace spearmon placed 4th in the U.S. trials, but was allowed to run at the world championships because Crawford who beat him at the trials was injured and couldn't run. John Capel was the previous world champion so the U.S. had 4 athletes competing since Capel was still running.
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Post by off on Jan 10, 2008 1:11:12 GMT -5
It's actually 3 out of 5 of the guys who have run under 9.80.
Ben Johnson - 9.79 Tim Montgomery - 9.78 Justin Gatlin - 9.77
My thing with drugs is that, running fast alone isn't the biggest factor. Because there are people who haven't broken 10.1 who are just as drugged up as the people who have run under 10.0. Things to look for in most cases are technical improvements, whether the coaching change made a difference, and in SOME cases, physical appearance. But even then it's not enough.
Kim Collins for example has a 9.98 pr. But has publicly acknowledged that he won't lift weights. Literally refuses too. I know you've seen him. And it's pretty obvious he could use a squat or two. Now if we're to assume he's clean, then that means it's possible then that a guy can run sub10 without drugs. And a without a weight program for that matter. So let's say someone else more talented than Kim, and in a structured lifting program gets with a great coach. Now what do we get? 9.86?
For example, all of Asafa's 9.7 races except for one were at +1.0 wind or higher. So his basic times were never below 9.83. The 9.78 with 0.0w he ran this year is the fastest time he's ever run. Up until then, Mo Greene was the fastest.
So if you were to look at his times again, and factor in the wind, it would look like this.
2002 - 10.19 2003 - 10.06 2004 - 9.88 2005 - 9.85 2006 - 9.83 2007 - 9.79
Also think of this. Powell had just started running track in 2001. Think of how much room for improvement an athlete has as a beginner. We're not talking about a vet in the middle of his career. He hasn't been beat up from being overtrain and over raced in high school or college. He's only 25.
The guys in the early 90's were inconsistant all across the board. That's why you had guys run 9.96 one year, and never approach it again for 3-4 years. The coaching on the whole is better now, the training is improved, etc. Make no mistake, i'm not naive, and I wouldn't be surprised if Powell or anyone else was on drugs. But I won't come to that conclusion simply because he's run fast, and pr'd. He runs the 100m better than anyone not named Maurice Greene. Technically speaking, you'd have a hard time finding anything wrong with his technique physically. So the possibility of him being on drugs is as much as anyone else for obvious reasons. Especially with people testing negative who were actually on drugs. I just try not to assume people can or can't do anything becuase of the wrong reasons.
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Post by off on Jan 10, 2008 1:12:46 GMT -5
Best All-Time Adjusted 100-meter Performances
Adj. Real Wind Name Site Date Pos. Meet 9.79 9.78 0.0 Asafa Powell Rieti 9-Sept-2007 1r2 GP 9.80 9.79 +0.1 Maurice Greene Athens 16-Jun-1999 1r3 GP II WR 9.81 9.80 +0.2 -----Greene Seville 22-Aug-1999 1 WCh 9.82 9.84 -0.5 Tyson Gay Indianapolis 22-Jun-2007 1 USATF 9.83 9.82 -0.2 -----Greene Edmonton 5-Aug-2001 1 WCh 9.83 9.77 +1.0 -----Asafa Powell Zurich 18-Aug-2006 1 GP =WR 9.83 9.86 -0.5 -----Powell Berlin 3-Sep-2006 1 9.83 9.74 +1.7------Powell Rieti 9-Sept-2007 1r1 GP WR
9.85 9.86 -0.4 Ato Boldon Athens 17-Jun-1998 1 9.85 9.84 +0.2 Bruny Surin Seville 22-Aug-1999 2 WCh 9.85 9.86 -0.2 -----Greene Berlin 1-Sep-2000 1r1 ISTAF 9.85 9.87 -0.3 -----Greene Sydney 23-Sep-2000 1 OG 9.85 9.77 +1.6 -----Powell Athens 14-Jun-2005 1 WR 9.85 9.77 +1.7 Justin Gatlin Doha 12-May-2006 1 =WR 9.85 9.77 +1.5 -----Powell Gateshead 11-Jun-2006 1 =WR
9.86 9.86 -0.4 Frank Fredericks Lausanne 3-Jul-1996 1r1 Athl 9.86 9.87 -0.1 -----Gatlin New York City 3-Jun-2006 1 9.86 9.85 +0.1 -----Powell Saint-Denis 8-Jul-2006 1rA GP
9.87 9.88 -0.1 -----Boldon Kuala Lumpur 17-Sep-1998 1 CG 9.87 9.86 +0.1 -----Boldon Athens 16-Jun-1999 2r3 GP II 9.87 9.93 -1.2 -----Gatlin Indianapolis 23-Jun-2006 1 USATF 9.87 9.86 +0.2 -----Powell Stockholm 25-Jul-2006 1rA 9.87 9.76 +2.2 -----Gay New York City 2-Jun-2007 1 GP
9.88 9.86 +0.2 -----Greene Athens 3-Aug-1997 1 WCh 9.88 9.87 +0.2 -----Powell Brussels 3-Sep-2004 1 9.88 9.85 +0.5 -----Powell Rome 14-Jul-2006 1rA GGala 9.88 9.91 -0.6 -----Powell London 28-Jul-2006 1
9.89 9.87 +0.3 Linford Christie Stuttgart 15-Aug-1993 1 WCh 9.89 9.84 +0.7 Donovan Bailey Atlanta 27-Jul-1996 1 OG WR 9.89 9.85 +0.8 -----Greene Rome 7-Jul-1999 1 GGala 9.89 9.91 -0.4 -----Greene Osaka 13-May-2000 1 GP 9.89 9.91 -0.3 -----Powell London 30-Jul-2004 1 9.89 9.85 +0.6 -----Gatlin Athens 22-Aug-2004 1 9.89 9.98 -1.6 -----Powell Monaco 18-Sep-2004 1 9.89 9.85 +0.6 -----Powell Ostrava 9-Jun-2005 1r2
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Post by hoggin88 on Jan 15, 2008 20:13:19 GMT -5
dbandre, When I read those posts about Gatlin and Powell's pr's, I read a bunch of nothing. I know you know a lot about track but do you seriously have to try to say something about everything? That was such an unconvincing argument and useless stats. Thank you "off" for accounting for the wind speeds. And I agree that I'm not ready to assume ped usage because of someone's pr's.
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Post by dbandre on Jan 16, 2008 19:06:23 GMT -5
Hoggin:
It's really not a bunch of nothing, all the fastest times are running with a prevailing wind, i never claimed either way on the wind adjustments. However, 2 things come to my mind, the statistical improvement made by each of the runners to run below 9.80 under legal wind conditions have similar periods of improvements and then periods of staleness following years winning the Olympic or World title. Considering that the majority of runners who ran under 9.80 with legal wind doped, it's not unreasonable to assume those who follow similar development patterns who also ran under 9.80 with legal wind and did not test positive also doped. That is both an assumption and opinion, which I feel I am entitled to believe and defend as you can with your opinions and assumptions. Can I prove Greene and Powell used PED's? No. Can anyone prove Powell slowed down of his own volition in the first heat for the WR? No, not with the known facts. However, I just can't buy someone running under 9.7s with a legal wind right now unless they are doping, to suggest Powell slowed down would make believe for certain he was doping, because he likely would have ran 9.70s or faster given the splits. However I don't think he slowed down, I think he looked good throughout the whole race. That doesn't mean that I don't think he is using PED's or not. However as of this moment I believe that his inconsistencies are pointing towards the use of PED's even though as far back as 2 years ago in his career he may not have.
I think if you look at the careers of runners that ran under 10s that were never caught using PED's or never used them compared to those who have been caught it becomes quite clear that the development process of those who likely never used PED's is different from those who did and those who likely did but did not get caught. Don't be foolish to believe that there are not patterns in development even in the most freakish of athletes talentwise. Baseball went on denying this for years, the NFL finally become proactive in getting PED's out, but over half of the players at these positions WR, RB, DE, LB, CB, and Safety in the NFL have probably taken PED's. Cycling just keeps going through travesty after travesty with doping and the riders and teams are finally becoming one of the cleanest sports around.
Which leads us to the Justin Gatlin argument in this thread, he competed at the 2006 US Championships which was in June of 2006. Regardless of his results being nullified at the championships, his 2 year suspension should end in mid June 2008, which is well clear of May Olympic Trials this year. Not only that he needs to run a qualifying time at a sanctioned race in order to be able to compete at the Olympic Trials. My hope is that CAS doesn't reduce his suspension to the Kansas Relays date since he competed after that. I believe that even if they do that no race organizer allows him too race if legally possible to do so before the Trials. Justin Gatlin doesn't deserve a chance to represent the US at this next Olympics and he should prove himself to be free of PED's for a 4 year period before he can go for a World or Olympic title representing the US.
If you really want to start checking this out look at the women's field events performance over the last 30-40 years. Compare the results from the late 70's and 80's to today.
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Post by anthonyj on Jan 30, 2008 9:16:00 GMT -5
I read this article and just laughed. Asafa Powell and Usain Bolt are lucky they are not American. Powell runs a 9.74 in the 100 and a 48 in the 400! I know some coaches who would not tolerate that. Bolt, Powell and Simpson busy with 400s in Kingston Monday 28 January 2008 World Championships 200m silver medallist Usain Bolt beat Asafa Powell in the men's 400m, while Sherone Simpson ran a personal best in the women's race at Saturday's Queens/Grace Jackson Invitational Meet at the National Stadium east field (26).
In the men's 400m, Bolt, running in the same heat as World 100m record holder Asafa Powell, won in 46.94 seconds to break the five-year-old meet record of 47.0. Bolt, the national 200m record holder at 19.75 seconds making him the ninth equal quickest 200m runner in history, was pleased with his performance over double the distance.
"I have been training for the 400m this season, so I just went out there to see how fast I could go and so 46.94 is not a bad time," said Bolt.
Meanwhile Powell, who finished down the track in 48.76secs, the 12th fastest time of the day, admitted his approach was wrong.
"I went out a little too hard and was trying to run on in the last 100 metres, but I wasn't strong enough," explained Powell, who had targeted a 45 seconds run.
In the meantime, Simpson's time of 52.21 seconds was brilliant, especially following a series of below-par performances last year on her comeback from injury. G.C. Foster College's Anastasia Le-Roy, was the closest challenger to Simpson, and finished second in 52.57.
After the race, Simpson said, "training has been going very well; I'm just taking each race at a time and ensure what I need to do to stay healthy because I really want to do well at the Olympics.”
Anthony Foster for the IAAF
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Post by dbandre on Jan 30, 2008 11:56:28 GMT -5
Anthony:
I agree most american coaches wouldn't tolerate that, however, I think the Jamaicans have shown their elite's are among the best of the best at their specialized events. It's still January too and they prefer the short to long approach, using early season outdoor races as Special Endurance workouts it seems.
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Post by anthonyj on Feb 4, 2008 7:48:56 GMT -5
Former Olympian sprinter Greene announces retirement ESPN.com news services
BEIJING -- Former Olympic sprinter Maurice Greene announced his retirement on Monday.
"Today I'm officially announcing my retirement from the sport," the 33-year-old American told reporters in Beijing, which is hosting this summer's Olympic Games.
"I don't think I can have that mental battle with myself coming back from injury anymore ... I want other people in the sport to shine."
Greene has been one of the sport's dominant figures of the past decade, winning both the 100 meters and 200 at the 1999 World Championships in Seville, Spain.
He won a third gold medal in the 100 relay, placing him alongside Tyson Gay and Carl Lewis as one of only three men to win triple gold.
He said he planned to pursue coaching and business interests in the United States.
"It's a little sad for me but it's happy at the same time because I've had a great career. I've done a lot of great things," Greene said.
The Associated Press and Reuters contributed to this report.
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Post by anthonyj on Apr 13, 2008 21:30:39 GMT -5
It's Maurice Greene's turn to defend/explain himself.
N.Y. Times: Steroids witness names Graham, Jones and Greene
NEW YORK -- A witness in the federal investigation into performance-enhancing drugs said he advised and supplied track coach Trevor Graham and his athletes, including Marion Jones, as well as Maurice Greene, The New York Times reported on its Web site.
Citing court filings, the newspaper said Saturday that Angel Guillermo Heredia, identified as Source A in the felony indictment, agreed to be a cooperating witness when investigators confronted him with evidence of his own drug trafficking and money laundering. The Times reported Heredia said he has provided prosecutors with the names of many elite track athletes and Olympic medal winners, as well as documentation.
The newspaper said in recent interviews Heredia described how and with whom he worked, sharing copies of records that appear to link him to many of the best sprinters of the last decade, including e-mail exchanges of doping regimens, canceled checks, telephone recordings, shipping records, and laboratory readings of blood and urine samples, as well as Justice Department documents.
Among his clients, Heredia identified 12 Olympic medalists, including Greene, the two-time Olympic gold medalist and five-time world champion who has never been previously linked to performance-enhancing drugs. Greene has never failed a drug test, and the newspaper said Greene didn't respond to numerous requests for comment.
The Times said Heredia showed it a copy of a bank transaction form showing a $10,000 wire transfer from a Maurice Greene to a relative of Heredia's, two sets of blood-test lab reports with Greene's name and age on them and an e-mail message from a close friend and track club teammate of Greene's, attaching one of the lab reports and saying, "Angel, this is maurices results sorry it took so long."
Graham, charged with three counts of making false statements, has pleaded not guilty. The Times reported his lawyers have said they will expose prominent athletes who were Heredia's clients, and that they'll prove him to be a tainted witness who continued to dispense drugs and who should be the one facing charges.
Jones is serving six months in prison for lying to investigators about using performance-enhancing drugs and her role in a check-fraud scam.
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Post by dbandre on Apr 13, 2008 23:01:45 GMT -5
It's Maurice Greene's turn to defend/explain himself. N.Y. Times: Steroids witness names Graham, Jones and Greene NEW YORK -- A witness in the federal investigation into performance-enhancing drugs said he advised and supplied track coach Trevor Graham and his athletes, including Marion Jones, as well as Maurice Greene, The New York Times reported on its Web site. Citing court filings, the newspaper said Saturday that Angel Guillermo Heredia, identified as Source A in the felony indictment, agreed to be a cooperating witness when investigators confronted him with evidence of his own drug trafficking and money laundering. The Times reported Heredia said he has provided prosecutors with the names of many elite track athletes and Olympic medal winners, as well as documentation. The newspaper said in recent interviews Heredia described how and with whom he worked, sharing copies of records that appear to link him to many of the best sprinters of the last decade, including e-mail exchanges of doping regimens, canceled checks, telephone recordings, shipping records, and laboratory readings of blood and urine samples, as well as Justice Department documents. Among his clients, Heredia identified 12 Olympic medalists, including Greene, the two-time Olympic gold medalist and five-time world champion who has never been previously linked to performance-enhancing drugs. Greene has never failed a drug test, and the newspaper said Greene didn't respond to numerous requests for comment. The Times said Heredia showed it a copy of a bank transaction form showing a $10,000 wire transfer from a Maurice Greene to a relative of Heredia's, two sets of blood-test lab reports with Greene's name and age on them and an e-mail message from a close friend and track club teammate of Greene's, attaching one of the lab reports and saying, "Angel, this is maurices results sorry it took so long." Graham, charged with three counts of making false statements, has pleaded not guilty. The Times reported his lawyers have said they will expose prominent athletes who were Heredia's clients, and that they'll prove him to be a tainted witness who continued to dispense drugs and who should be the one facing charges. Jones is serving six months in prison for lying to investigators about using performance-enhancing drugs and her role in a check-fraud scam. I think its time athletes start explaining their significant drops in performance after winning WC and OLY medals.
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Post by anthonyj on Apr 17, 2008 19:37:44 GMT -5
It appears that the IAAF isn't buying the claim that Maurice Greene used performance enhancing drugs.
Former Olympic and world sprint champion Maurice Greene denies claims of drug use Associated Press
BRUSSELS, Belgium -- Track and field's world governing body dismissed doping allegations against former Olympic sprint champion Maurice Greene, throwing its support behind the man who once held the 100-meter world record.
Greene also denied the accusations, which were made by a witness in a U.S. government investigation into sports doping and reported this past weekend in the New York Times.
"None of this is new," International Association of Athletics Federations spokesman Nick Davies told The Associated Press. "There is no reason to take action against Maurice."
Davies said the IAAF would continue to use Greene as one of its goodwill ambassadors to promote the sport in the run-up to the Beijing Olympics.
"With every ambassador we do an immediate check with the doping department," Davies said by telephone from IAAF headquarters in Monaco. "In this case they said, `No, we don't have anything."
The Times reported that the witness, Angel Guillermo Heredia, said he advised and supplied banned substances to track coach Trevor Graham and athletes including Greene and Marion Jones.
"I read about this guy and this rumor four years ago," Davies said.
Citing court filings, the Times said that Heredia -- identified as Source A in the documents -- agreed to be a cooperating witness when investigators confronted him with evidence of his own drug trafficking and money laundering. The newspaper said Heredia provided prosecutors with the names of elite athletes, including 12 Olympic medal winners, who allegedly used performance-enhancing substances, and also provided documentation.
Among his clients, the Times said Heredia identified Greene, a two-time Olympic gold medalist and five-time world champion who never previously has been linked to doping. Greene, who retired in February, never failed a doping test.
Greene told Britain's Daily Telegraph that he had met with Heredia but did not receive or use any drugs.
"This is a bad situation for me," he was quoted as saying in Monday's editions. "My name's coming up in something and it's not true. ... I have met him before and when he was talking to me, I told him I don't believe in this stuff."
Davies said the U.S. Anti-Doping Agency had been looking into the link for years without finding any proof.
"If it was Maurice, it was not enough to even interest USADA, who are very interested," Davies said.
Greene won the gold in the 100 meters at the 2000 Sydney Games and was part of the winning U.S. 400-meter relay team. He once held the 100 record, and still holds the indoor 60 world record.
Greene was linked to doping by Heredia as part of the case against Graham, who is charged in a federal case in San Francisco with three counts of making false statements. He has pleaded not guilty.
"I have met with a lot of people who wanted me to try this and that," Greene told the Telegraph. "Everyone wanted me to work with them. But me getting anything or doing anything? I have not.
"My stance has always been that there is no place in our sport for drug users. I have always said that you should be banned for life if you come up positive even once. I stand by that."
Greene said he used to pay for items for other members of his training group, but didn't know what he was paying for.
"Our group was very close and things always came up," he said. "I would pay for stuff and not care what it was. I've paid for things for other people."
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