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Post by dbandre on Apr 17, 2008 21:44:42 GMT -5
You do realize Greene's comments at the end of article are now being questioned by the IAAF. Right now I am at a loss, because over the past 10-11 years we have been cheated of the real worlds fastest human it seems, it's not just Greene, it's Raymond Stewart and Ato Boldon, and others. Is the last potential clean WR holder Donovan Bailey?
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Post by hoggin88 on Apr 18, 2008 0:34:33 GMT -5
You do realize Greene's comments at the end of article are now being questioned by the IAAF. Right now I am at a loss, because over the past 10-11 years we have been cheated of the real worlds fastest human it seems, it's not just Greene, it's Raymond Stewart and Ato Boldon, and others. Is the last potential clean WR holder Donovan Bailey? You still should have no reason to doubt Powell - and I've heard your argument against him- but I think at least right now we need to consider him a clean WR holder. Are you saying Greene is getting cheated by Powell or what? Definitely Boldon got ripped off of some glory though.
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Post by dbandre on Apr 18, 2008 7:12:57 GMT -5
The story implicated Boldon and Stewart, which leaves Bailey and Francis Obikwelu as the only non implicated medalists in WC's and OG's since 1996 in the 100m Dash.
I still have every reason to doubt Powell. When you look at the data of Powell compared to those who were caught or have been implicated it eye-popping in it's similarity. It's even more eyepopping when you compare it to Bailey and Obikwelu and Mark Francis-Lewis.
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Post by hoggin88 on Apr 19, 2008 0:47:42 GMT -5
Oh I see. I guess I didn't understand it right. I didn't know Boldon was implicated of anything - besides that ephedrine thing in '01 that got legitimized.
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Post by dbandre on Apr 19, 2008 2:21:11 GMT -5
Just to put this into perspective I added these athletes and their season best marks to consider for the 100m dash and doping. Right now I would say Stewart passes the smell test and is likely not a doper, but if he was it would call into question every single human to run under 10.00s for 100m. Lewis and Burrell have been suspected of using them for years. Burrell's 9.85 personal best was with a 1.2 wind which adjusts higher than 9.90s. Lewis's 9.86 was also with a 1.2 wind and even though they were suspected, if they were clean they were .1s slower than the dopers of the new generation. The anomaly seems to be 1996, either doping was rampant and testing was so far behind or the fastest track surfaces ever manufactured, Bailey's 100m 9.84 and Johnson 200m 19.32 and many think of them to be the cleanest sprinters ever. You decide if it was advancement in track or pharmaceutical technology? I listed Mike Marsh because he's considered to be the greatest HS sprinter in US history.
Really, I am at a point were I know cheaters are beating the system and the results bear this out to some degree. When the system catches up or someone wins a championship medal their times suffer.
Is this sport clean look at 1990,1996, 1999, 2001 and 2004 were all years where times seemed to peak and now in 2008 we are looking at next wave of busts as the testers catch up to the cheaters. 2007 was a banner year and I doubt anyone comes close to sub 9.8s without getting busted. It takes the testers 2-3 years to catch up. The IAAF needs to go back to 4 year bans for first offenses. The suspension period needs to be longer than the catch up period.
Ato Boldon 2004 10.09 -0.6 Port-of-Spain 19 06 2004 2003 10.09 0.7 Paris Saint-Denis 24 08 2003 2002 10.23 0.9 Roma 12 07 2002 2001 9.88 2 Oslo 13 07 2001 2000 9.95 1 Lausanne 05 07 2000 1999 9.86 0.1 Athína 16 06 1999 1998 9.86 -0.4 Athína 17 06 1998 1997 9.87 1.3 Athína 02 08 1997 1996 9.90 0.7 Atlanta, GA 27 07 1996 1995 10.03 1 Göteborg 06 08 1995 1994 10.07 1.9 Victoria 23 08 1994 1993 10.23 0.7 Fresno, CA 05 05 1993 1992 10.22 1.7 Modesto, CA 08 05 1992 1991 10.54 1991 Powell 2007 9.74 1.7 Rieti 2006 9.77 1 Zürich 18 08 2006 2005 9.77 1.6 Athína (Olympic Stadium) 14 06 2005 2004 9.87 0.2 Bruxelles 03 09 2004 2003 10.02 0.8 Bruxelles 05 09 2003 2002 10.12 1.3 Rovereto 28 08 2002
Greene 2006 10.35 -0.5 Baie Mahault 01 05 2006 2005 10.01 1.9 Carson, CA 25 06 2005 2004 9.87 0.6 Athína 22 08 2004 2003 9.94 1.4 Carson, CA 01 06 2003 2002 9.89 0.9 Roma 12 07 2002 2001 9.82 -0.2 Edmonton 05 08 2001 2000 9.86 -0.2 Berlin 01 09 2000 1999 9.79 0.1 Athína 16 06 1999 1998 9.90 0.3 Stockholm 05 08 1998 1997 9.86 0.2 Athína 03 08 1997 1996 10.08 0.3 Atlanta, GA 14 06 1996 1995 10.19 0.8 Bratislava 30 05 1995 1993 10.43 1993 Raymond Stewart 2001 10.34 1.60 Arlington, TX 05/05/2001 2000 10.31 0.50 Kingston 21/07/2000 1999 10.22 1.60 Nassau 26/05/1999 1997 10.27 0.00 Roma 05/06/1997 1995 10.17 1.80 Göteborg 06/08/1995 1994 10.21 1.60 São Paulo 21/05/1994 1993 10.11 -0.10 Stuttgart 14/08/1993 1992 10.22 0.50 Barcelona 01/08/1992 1991 9.96 1.20 Tokyo 25/08/1991 1989 9.97 1.00 Waco, TX 20/05/1989 1987 10.08 1.00 Roma 30/08/1987 1984 10.19 Port of Spain 19/05/1984 1983 10.22 2.30 Helsinki 07/08/1983 Carl Lewis 1997 10.51 -0.60 Zürich 13/08/1997 1995 10.25 0.80 Paris 03/07/1995 1994 10.14 0.20 Roma 08/06/1994 1993 10.02 0.30 Stuttgart 15/08/1993 1993 10.02 0.30 Stuttgart 15/08/1993 1991 9.86 1.20 Tokyo 25/08/1991 1988 9.92 1.10 Seoul 24/09/1988 1987 9.93 1.00 Roma 30/08/1987 1985 9.98 1.60 Modesto, CA 11/05/1985 1984 9.99 0.20 Los Angeles, CA 04/08/1984 1983 9.97 1.50 Modesto, CA 14/05/1983 1982 10.00 1.90 Modesto, CA 15/05/1982 1981 10.00 0.00 Dallas, TX 16/05/1981
Leroy Burrell 1997 10.08 0.80 Lausanne 02/07/1997 1994 9.85 1.20 Lausanne 06/07/1994 1993 10.02 Zürich 04/08/1993 1992 9.97 -1.30 Barcelona 01/08/1992 1991 9.88 1.20 Tokyo 25/08/1991 1990 9.96 0.70 Villeneuve-d'Ascq 29/06/1990 1989 9.94 0.80 Houston, TX 16/06/1989 1988 10.31 01/01/1988 1986 10.46 01/01/1986 1985 10.43 01/01/1985 Donovan Bailey 2001 10.20 0.00 Edmonton 04/08/2001 2001 10.20 0.00 Ingolstadt 27/05/2001 2000 9.98 -0.70 Luzern 27/06/2000 1999 10.30 1.70 La Chaux-de-Fonds 15/08/1999 1999 10.30 0.20 Köln 08/08/1999 1998 9.93 1.50 Montréal 01/08/1998 1997 9.91 0.50 Athína 03/08/1997 1997 9.91 0.20 Athína 03/08/1997 1996 9.84 0.70 Atlanta, GA 27/07/1996 1995 9.91 1.30 Montréal 15/07/1995 1994 10.03 1.80 Duisburg 12/06/1994 1993 10.36 1.80 22/05/1993 1992 10.42 01/01/1992 1991 10.42 01/01/1991
Francis Obikwelu 2007 10.06 0.90 Oslo 15/06/2007 2006 9.99 1.30 Göteborg 08/08/2006 2005 10.04 1.60 Athína (Olympic Stadium) 14/06/2005 2004 9.86 0.60 Athína 22/08/2004 2003 10.11 1.50 Zürich 15/08/2003 2002 10.01 0.30 Bruxelles 30/08/2002 2001 9.98 0.60 Berlin 31/08/2001 2000 9.97 1.00 Lausanne 05/07/2000 1999 10.01 0.00 Johannesburg 15/09/1999 1998 10.01 0.00 Oslo 09/07/1998 1997 10.10 1.20 Lisboa 20/06/1997 1996 10.12 0.40 Granada 29/05/1996 1995 10.31 1.30 Lisboa 05/07/1995
Mark Lewis-Francis 2007 10.17 -0.60 Osaka 25/08/2007 2006 10.16 1.30 Göteborg 08/08/2006 2005 10.13 1.80 Kingston, JAM 07/05/2005 2004 10.12 0.00 Athína 21/08/2004 2003 10.07 0.00 Ostrava 12/06/2003 2002 10.04 0.40 Paris Saint-Denis 05/07/2002 2001 10.12 -1.30 Tallahassee, FL 14/04/2001 2000 10.10 1.90 London 05/08/2000 1999 10.31 0.20 Neubrandenburg 21/08/1999 1998 10.49 01/01/1998
Jason Gardner 2007 10.28 0.50 Athína (Olympic Stadium) 02/07/2007 2006 10.37 1.60 Oslo 02/06/2006 2005 10.08 -1.00 Helsinki 07/08/2005 2004 10.12 0.20 Athína 22/08/2004 2003 10.17 0.00 Linz 31/07/2003 2002 10.13 1.90 Birmingham 13/07/2002 2001 10.23 0.90 Sevilla 08/06/2001 2000 10.09 1.00 Lausanne 05/07/2000 1999 9.98 0.40 Lausanne 02/07/1999 1998 10.30 -1.70 Birmingham 25/07/1998 1997 10.31 0.90 Birmingham 24/08/1997 1995 10.33 -0.50 Genève 17/06/1995 1994 10.25 1.20 Lisboa 21/07/1994 Mike Marsh 2000 10.01 0.20 Raleigh, NC 17/06/2000 1999 10.21 -0.20 Raleigh, NC 12/06/1999 1997 9.97 2.00 Indianapolis, IN 12/06/1997 1996 9.95 1.30 Walnut, CA 21/04/1996 1995 10.08 1.80 Göteborg 06/08/1995 1994 10.00 1.00 Walnut, CA 17/04/1994 1993 10.20 New York, NY 22/05/1993 1992 9.93 -0.60 Walnut, CA 18/04/1992
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Post by hoggin88 on Apr 19, 2008 11:19:40 GMT -5
The story implicated Boldon and Stewart, which leaves Bailey and Francis Obikwelu as the only non implicated medalists in WC's and OG's since 1996 in the 100m Dash. I might sound dumb for asking, but "WC's" stands for world championships right? Because if so, then Bailey and Obikwelu aren't the only non-implicated sprinters in that time period are they? These are the medalists from World Championships in the 100m since 1997 1997 Gold - Maurice Greene USA United States 9.86 1997 Silver - Donovan Bailey CAN Canada 9.91 1997 Bronze - Tim Montgomery USA United States 9.94 1999 Gold - Maurice Greene USA United States 9.80 1999 Silver - Bruny Surin CAN Canada 9.84 1999 Bronze - Dwain Chambers GBR Great Britain 9.97 2001 Gold - Maurice Greene USA United States 9.82 2001 Silver - Tim Montgomery USA United States 9.85 2001 Bronze - Bernard Williams USA United States 9.94 2003 Gold - Kim Collins SKN St Kitts & Nevis 10.07 2003 Silver - Darrel Brown TRI Trinidad & Tobago 10.08 2003 Bronze - Darren Campbell GBR Great Britain 10.08 2005 Gold - Justin Gatlin USA United States 9.88 2005 Silver - Michael Frater JAM Jamaica 10.05 2005 Bronze - Kim Collins SKN St Kitts & Nevis 10.05 2007 Gold - Tyson Gay USA United States 9.85 2007 Silver - Derrick Atkins BAH Bahamas 9.91 2007 Bronze - Asafa Powell JAM Jamaica 9.96 I know several of these guys have obviously been implicated or suspended, but another several haven't - unless I'm mistaken. And what about Tyson Gay? He's clean as far we know and ran 9.85.
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Post by dbandre on Apr 19, 2008 14:41:05 GMT -5
There are 12 implicated sprinters in total and most of them are reported to be medalists in the World Championships or Olympics. That means besides Montgomery, Gatlin, and Chambers there are 12 more cheats out there. How many are male and how many are female we don't know yet, but it's certain that alot will be revealed in time. The legal system in the US is catching more cheaters than the testing system.
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Post by plyometric on Apr 21, 2008 10:42:40 GMT -5
Every runner is under suspicion when they line up and run. They test them, not because they're clean, what would be the point of that. As long as there are masking agents, in which they're still available, you will be able to get around the system. Whoever wants to cheat, can and will, sad part, you don't know until after the fact, not before.
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Post by anthonyj on May 2, 2008 6:40:17 GMT -5
This is crazy.
Report: Montgomery arrested on heroin distribution charges Associated Press
NORFOLK, Va. -- Former track star Tim Montgomery has been indicted on heroin distribution charges, the Virginian-Pilot of Norfolk reported Thursday.
The 33-year-old sprinter was arrested Wednesday on a sealed indictment, accused of dealing more than 100 grams of heroin in Virginia over the past year, according to the newspaper.
Montgomery was being held at the Portsmouth city jail, said Karin Johnson, public information officer for the Portsmouth sheriff's office. She said U.S. marshals brought him in Wednesday night.
Montgomery told the newspaper he knew nothing of the accusations and that his arrest was a "total surprise."
"You get caught up in the achievements," he said. "You get blinded and make really bad mistakes."
The former 100-meter world record-holder is to be sentenced May 16 in a New York-based check-kiting conspiracy. Montgomery, who pleaded guilty, admitted he helped his former coach, Olympic champion Steve Ridthingy, and others cash $1.7 million in stolen and counterfeit checks. He faces up to 46 months in prison.
Ridthingy is serving a five-year prison term. Montgomery's former companion, Olympic gold medalist Marion Jones, is serving a six-month prison term for lying to investigators about the check-fraud scam and using steroids.
Montgomery won a gold medal in the 400 relay at the 2000 Olympics and a silver medal in the 400 relay at the 1996 Olympics.
In December 2005, Montgomery was banned from track for two years for doping and he retired. All of his performances after March 31, 2001, were wiped from the books, including his world record of 9.78 seconds in the 100-meter dash in September 2002.
Copyright 2008 by The Associated Press
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Post by anthonyj on May 16, 2008 6:08:16 GMT -5
The trial is about to start, the track and field world will be watching.
Leading track and field athletes hope Graham trial restores trust Associated Press
Updated: May 15, 2008, 9:29 PM ET
CARSON, Calif. -- Several leading U.S. track and field athletes say they are hoping the upcoming trial of once-prominent coach Trevor Graham will clear the air and bring an end to the latest ugly chapter in the drug-stained sport.
Jeremy Wariner, Olympic gold medalist and two-time world 400-meter champ, is asking those turned off by the sport's troubles "to believe in us again."
Wariner, Tyson Gay and Veronica Campbell-Brown were among those who appeared at a news conference Thursday in advance of Sunday's Adidas Classic, the first of the three major U.S. meets leading up to the U.S. Olympic trials in late June.
Graham, whose former pupils include disgraced sprinter Marion Jones, goes on trial in San Francisco on Monday on charges of lying to federal investigators when he denied he obtained performance-enhancing drugs from weight trainer Angel "Memo" Heredia.
Several of Graham's former athletes are expected to testify for the prosecution, including former Olympic 1,600-meter relay champion Antonio Pettigrew.
"Hopefully this trial does help and crack it down and break everything out," Wariner said. "Like I've said in the past, I'm clean, I know I'm clean, so I get on the line and just do what I've got to do."
Gay said it's legitimate for the sport's elite athletes to be quizzed about the use of performance-enhancing drugs, and he knows many more questions will be coming as the Beijing Olympics grow near.
"I don't really pay attention to a lot of things like that," Gay said. "I just try to focus on training, but besides that, it's your job to ask questions. I understand that. It's our job to answer them. If it wasn't happening, we wouldn't be in this situation. Unfortunately we have to face the problem and hope that everything changes around."
Gay, the reigning world 100- and 200-meter champion, has joined world champion sprinter Allyson Felix, Olympic silver medalist decathlete Bryan Clay and nine others in a pilot program that the U.S. Anti-Doping Agency hopes will improve the accuracy of tests.
Gay and the others are undergoing a series of blood and urine tests as part of the program.
"I'm busy doing things and I couldn't make some of the meetings and they understand that," Gay said. "They're still satisfied with the fact that I'm going along with the program and helping as much as possible to prove to the world that there are clean athletes in the sport."
Campbell-Brown, the 2004 Olympic 200 gold medalist and reigning world 100 champion, said the subject simply upsets her.
"I really hate talking about doping because I really don't think drugs belong in the sport," the talented Jamaican said. "A lot of athletes I think are competing clean like myself. ... I just wish that the sport could be cleaner so we could all have fun."
Bianca Knight, the 19-year-old sprinter who left the University of Texas to turn professional last winter, said the idea that competitors are doping has taken the fun out of the sport for her.
"Now I think it's all about business and it's all about running a fast time and breaking this record, and people will do anything to continue those extreme numbers," she said. "When Trevor goes on trial, I hope it cracks down a lot of people to make the sport cleaner and make it fun again."
Four-time U.S. pole vault champion Jenn Stuczynski said athletes need to be honest with themselves, as well as with those around them.
"Think of the consequences," she said. "What a disgrace to your family, yourself and your friends."
Copyright 2008 by The Associated Press
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Post by anthonyj on Aug 26, 2012 21:39:51 GMT -5
It's been a while!! And the World Record has changed hands, and dipped quite a bit. Usain Bolt is the man now, but in some ways I'm like Carl Lewis wondering how can someone go from 10.03 to 9.69 in a year. Yes, it turns out that King Carl was a doper, and is a hater, but despite that he has a point.
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Post by anthonyj on Aug 26, 2012 21:40:36 GMT -5
It's been a while!! And the World Record has changed hands, and dipped quite a bit. Usain Bolt is the man now, but in some ways I'm like Carl Lewis wondering how can someone go from 10.03 to 9.69 in a year. Yes, it turns out that King Carl was a doper, and is a hater, but despite that he has a point.
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